Altitude Hold improvement solution

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vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

Hi, maybe you should hold the arming-stick longer than before. That way I can trim ACC now.

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

@Mahowik: About % throttle at the hover point, how about hard-coded mid RC throttle value? Will it be more precise than percentage? With frsky telemetry we can read the throttle value at hover point.

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

Hello, I noticed that latest MWC zip file that i previously tested it was removed from Mahowik branch due to some unresolved "issues". Do we have anything new to test this coming weekend?

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

On r1271, mahowik has rolled back with log message: "rollback changes as not stable yet...".
I'm still flying ok, hello Mahowik?

wilco1967
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by wilco1967 »

no issues here also on version just before rollback..... flies just fine (better then ever before in fact...).

What where the issues ?

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

The altitude control works very good, the only issues where about arming/disarming that could be inherited from main trunk.Specifically, on Crius AIO PRO board, quad mode with camstab, buzzer, GPS, Vbat- enabled, i couldn't arm the copter from the first time, i had to try several times. Also in Altitude control mode, i was able to disarm the copter with yaw right.
But i repeat, the main objectives where achieved, meaning a better altitude control. I would be very happy that MWC 2.2 prerelease could include these new features

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

I don't get it:

After successfully implementation of altitude variation control by Mahowik almost two weeks ago, the shared trunk code remains the same. Let me remind you how nice the altitude control works, here is the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Sa-oyJ4Ljs

And in case the code is no longer availabe on Mahowik branch, i attached a zip file with the MWC source code you see flying in video above.
Attachments
MultiWii.zip
(119.38 KiB) Downloaded 9196 times

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jevermeister
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by jevermeister »

hi,
there is a list of people who can alter code over at the google code repository. I looked into my mqilbox today and found no mail regarding this.
I did not follow this thread closely enough to feel adressed to upload this code.

I would suggest to contact one of the devs to merge the code. How should those guys know
about that. There was no command to do so.
Do you expect them to sit and wait for every idea and development to be ready to merge?

please contact one of the devs directly and wait for negative or positive feedback.
I can only speak for myself here: I always have a hard time merging code that is to complicated for me to understand. I could fuck up the code without knowing why and how should I fix thise bugs...

Nils
ps.: I do not want to rant, just want you to understand some devs. ;-)

pps.:I like your fantastic work - If only I could understand these algorythms :-\

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

dramida wrote:I don't get it:

And in case the code is no longer availabe on Mahowik branch, i attached a zip file with the MWC source code you see flying in video above.


Hi dramida, if you want a merged version that Mahowik did on the main trunk, just checkout the version before he removed it

Code: Select all

svn co http://multiwii.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/MultiWii_shared -r 1268


And mahowik branch, with the zip file ;)

Code: Select all

svn co http://multiwii.googlecode.com/svn/branches/Mahowik -r 1268


It's always there.

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

jevermeister wrote:I can only speak for myself here: I always have a hard time merging code that is to complicated for me to understand. I could fuck up the code without knowing why and how should I fix thise bugs...


You merge the code manually by hand? without the confliction code, you can always merge code by command.

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jevermeister
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by jevermeister »

I am not merging by hand but I want to understand the code I contribute. I wanted to say, that I have a bad feeling everytime I commit something for someone I do not fully understand.

nils

mahowik
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by mahowik »

Hi guys,

Sorry for delays... My plans was little bit changed...
To be honest I did enough for the mwii project and comunity and it's time to do something for myself...
So now I'm trying to copy naza behaviour related to AH functions and altitude ascend/descend and going to distribute (individually) the firmware in *.hex format with flash tool/script...

I hope for your understanding...

thx-
Alex
Last edited by mahowik on Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

copterrichie
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by copterrichie »

I am not surprised, wish you well.

mahowik
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by mahowik »

what you are not surprised?! You know me very well? :)

copterrichie
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by copterrichie »

I am not surprised at your course of action, nothing else to say.

alexia
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by alexia »

mahowik wrote:Hi guys,

Sorry for delays... My plans was little bit changed...
To be honest I did enough for the mwii project and comunity and it's time to do something for myself...
So now I'm trying to copy naza behaviour related to AH functions and altitude ascend/descend and going to distribute (individually) the firmware in *.hex format with flash tool/script...

I hope for your understanding...

thx-
Alex



thanks for you hard working.
i understand if you want working for yourself.you are already made lots of for the communauty
thanks again
alexia

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

You've done a big improvement Mahowik, I guess dramida will miss you much :P. Have luck with your plan!

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

What a f :o k is happenning here? :shock: Can someone explain?

alexia
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by alexia »

nothing..just mahowick want to use is free time for other things
i hope that he doesn t move out of this incredible project

kipkool
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kipkool »

That's a pity but it's your choice of course.

As Multiwii is GPL, binary distribution without source is not an option, does this means you will develop a new flightcontroller code from scratch ?

mahowik
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by mahowik »

kipkool wrote:As Multiwii is GPL, binary distribution without source is not an option, does this means you will develop a new flightcontroller code from scratch ?

nothing decided exactly yet... but in any case thanks for the info...

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NikTheGreek
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by NikTheGreek »

Probably you will not count my opinion.. :(
But ..... there is any chance to reconsider your decision ?

Polleke
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by Polleke »

Hi Mohawik,
Thanks for the great work you've done :D
Wishing you all the best.
Hoped you'd say: "I'll be back!"

timecop
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by timecop »

mahowik wrote:Hi guys,

Sorry for delays... My plans was little bit changed...
To be honest I did enough for the mwii project and comunity and it's time to do something for myself...
So now I'm trying to copy naza behaviour related to AH functions and altitude ascend/descend and going to distribute (individually) the firmware in *.hex format with flash tool/script...

I hope for your understanding...

thx-
Alex


lol, naza.
will you add the magic wobble too?
can't wait!

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

Mahowik, move your ass back here and stop fooling around with binary distribution nonsense witch contradicts the GPL licence. If you are not working in a team, you'll end up wasteing your time.
If you want to do some good money with Multiwii, offer technical support for local/global users and/or do aerial pictures or video ( i do the same here http://www.fae-drones.com ). Open your own topic/branch with a big donate button on first post also will help. For more marketing strategies i would have to charge you ;)

dr.tom
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dr.tom »

don't kill the messenger,
I know that this my video is not taken by multirotor,
but just wanted to show how accurate can an old BMP085 sensor be, I still can't believe it.
on my multirotors I have MS5611 and although it does work better than BMP, it's still no 'Naza like' alt. hold.

watch the second half of the movie, on ground it says 0,when raised it says 2m, no drift and accurate,
in flight it can maintain altitude +/-1m even in 10km long run, no drift!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbk3ipTg ... 9A7DD761A7


It must be the code that makes all that difference, if someone is willing to dig deeper...

this OSD http://www.himodel.com/FPV_Telemetry/CY ... W_GPS.html
author of software is: Extraline http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=72169

(alt is not maintained by gps, I have also previous version 'Nova osd', it used gps for that and had a lot of oscilations, this uses baro for that)

copterrichie
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by copterrichie »

Within any given group of people and there is no exception here, there is going to be differences of opinions and personality clashes if GROUP THINK is not at play. There will even be a few trolls :mrgreen: , so lets not allow this fine outstanding group accomplishment to become tainted by harsh feelings. Now get back to work, all of you!!! :D

Groupthink is a psychological phenomenon that occurs within groups of people, in which the desire for harmony in a decision-making group overrides a realistic appraisal of alternatives. Group members try to minimize conflict and reach a consensus decision without critical evaluation of alternative ideas or viewpoints. Antecedent factors such as group cohesiveness, structural faults, and situational context play into the likelihood of whether or not groupthink will impact the decision-making process.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Group_think

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

dramida wrote:Mahowik, move your ass back here and stop fooling around with binary distribution nonsense witch contradicts the GPL licence. If you are not working in a team, you'll end up wasteing your time.
If you want to do some good money with Multiwii, offer technical support for local/global users and/or do aerial pictures or video ( i do the same here http://www.fae-drones.com ). Open your own topic/branch with a big donate button on first post also will help. For more marketing strategies i would have to charge you ;)


;)

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

dr.tom wrote:don't kill the messenger,
I know that this my video is not taken by multirotor,
but just wanted to show how accurate can an old BMP085 sensor be, I still can't believe it.
on my multirotors I have MS5611 and although it does work better than BMP, it's still no 'Naza like' alt. hold.

watch the second half of the movie, on ground it says 0,when raised it says 2m, no drift and accurate,
in flight it can maintain altitude +/-1m even in 10km long run, no drift!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbk3ipTg ... 9A7DD761A7


It must be the code that makes all that difference, if someone is willing to dig deeper...

this OSD http://www.himodel.com/FPV_Telemetry/CY ... W_GPS.html
author of software is: Extraline http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=72169

(alt is not maintained by gps, I have also previous version 'Nova osd', it used gps for that and had a lot of oscilations, this uses baro for that)



What is so yuuupi on that? This is how multiwii ALT code is working with this OSD.

http://youtu.be/QQKaCK15iKQ

dr.tom
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dr.tom »

nice,
but I am talking about 'alt hold', not 'alt display'.
in GUI my MWii also responses to 10cm change, nice to watch, but in air it's not so good. drifts by time...

...back to your OSD
how does it fly?
it's under development as written in video,
this is tested and flying as we speek. and controls altitude very good.

that's why I linked author of it so if someone has skill to look into his code(which works on common sensor used in mwii)
and see what could eventually be applied to mwc code.

I like the plug in option of your OSD, because that saves cable clutter, weight and price
(no need for double sensors onboard)

keep up the good work :)
Last edited by dr.tom on Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

dr.tom wrote:nice,
in GUI my MWii also responses to 10cm change, nice to watch, but in air it's not so good. drifts by time...

...back to your linked OSD
how does it fly?
it's under development as written in video,
this is tested and flying as we speek.

I like the plug in option, because that saves weight and price(no need for double sensors onboard)
keep up the good work :)


Yes we still have some oscillations of a few cm I think that this is awesome already. About flying drift, we will see.
As soon as the weather let me I will upload a flying video ;) but I´m "sure :geek: " it will behave well. I let you know soon.

mahowik
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by mahowik »

timecop wrote:
mahowik wrote:Hi guys,

Sorry for delays... My plans was little bit changed...
To be honest I did enough for the mwii project and comunity and it's time to do something for myself...
So now I'm trying to copy naza behaviour related to AH functions and altitude ascend/descend and going to distribute (individually) the firmware in *.hex format with flash tool/script...

I hope for your understanding...

thx-
Alex


lol, naza.
will you add the magic wobble too?
can't wait!


You doubt?! :)

I almost finished with vario controlled altitude ascend/descend for AH mode according to naza behavior (description was provided from naza-users from russian forum) and it's already tested by some guys... works nice! ;)

- center is 50% (1500)
- autocalibration of hovering throttle
- now it's even possible take off/fly up (just arm -> switch AH -> increase throttle smoothly - > after center it starts to take off)
- simple landing (just set desired vertical speed descend by stick... e.g. 0.5m/s and when it near land, just move throttle stick to min to avoid ground effect)

What news with your naze32? Also why you call it naze?! NAZA?! :)
How is your port of my AH solution, you still didn't get it working? LOL ;)

p.s. I don't know WTF means "magic wobble"...
Last edited by mahowik on Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Crashpilot1000
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by Crashpilot1000 »


mahowik
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by mahowik »

Crashpilot1000 wrote:Hmmmmm.... already done....viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2371&start=300#p26094

with vario PID controller (to make it independent from copter configuration)?

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Crashpilot1000
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by Crashpilot1000 »

In my opinion Vario PID is not needed. It get things unneccessary compilcated. My solution works quiet well with different copters. No need to do APM style and add a seperate PID controller for every movement. Anyway in the meantime i did an autoland as well wich can be easily upgraded with GPS functions. EEprom space is getting low - i think i will have to upgrade. But i refuse to spend any more money into 8 bit. Just my 2 cents.

alexia
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by alexia »

dramida wrote:Mahowik, move your ass back here and stop fooling around with binary distribution nonsense witch contradicts the GPL licence. If you are not working in a team, you'll end up wasteing your time.
If you want to do some good money with Multiwii, offer technical support for local/global users and/or do aerial pictures or video ( i do the same here http://www.fae-drones.com ). Open your own topic/branch with a big donate button on first post also will help. For more marketing strategies i would have to charge you ;)





+10000000
come back here

msev
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by msev »

Mahowik on which hardware do you plan to run your .hex's?

Magnetron
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by Magnetron »

mahowik wrote:Hi guys,

Sorry for delays... My plans was little bit changed...
To be honest I did enough for the mwii project and comunity and it's time to do something for myself...
So now I'm trying to copy naza behaviour related to AH functions and altitude ascend/descend and going to distribute (individually) the firmware in *.hex format with flash tool/script...

I hope for your understanding...

thx-
Alex


I understand your idea. I share your thought.
I leave multiwii project for now, I am trying my self code on my copters, in the future I can go back, but for the moment I think just like you.
;)

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

After taking a close look to some "different" topics on this forum (I saw them for some time now but... I just thought it was not so serious).
I think like a friend of mine that said "Alex should come forward before it is to late".
I must say well done my friends your contribution´s were/are amazing.

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

I can't belive that Mahowik, Timecop and Crashpilot1000 argue each other for hall of fame MWC codding. It's room for everyone to be important in this project: gps waypoint navi, autolanding , failsafe routine, adding numerous improvements - lists are there,

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

so all "sad" people here can't live without alt-hold :P ? and MultiWii is just that? It's improved (thanks to Mahowik) and will be improved again by someone later, there're good coders are flying multiwii out there. Alt-hold is acceptable now?

I see so many interesting features outside this topic, many nice & kind developers, please help they test & improve, instead of waiting, arguing, asking for more here.

Rainer
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by Rainer »

if we look back once a year and Multiwii compare to him stood from today.

there has been performed very much a lot, my thanks go to the developers.

one should not be also forgotten the people have seated its spare time for it.

Thanks for this excellent work.

scrat
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by scrat »

Thank's to all developers!

Can someone please tell me what is the latest dev version which is working ok. Thx. I'm using now r1177.

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

you can always checkout latest version, it's ok! i'm flying r1275.

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shikra
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by shikra »

Mahowik - I hope you stick around buddy, but understand if you move on.
We are all appreciative of your work....

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dramida
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by dramida »

vpb wrote:I see so many interesting features outside this topic, many nice & kind developers, please help they test & improve, instead of waiting, arguing, asking for more here.

+1

And one other fact:
Multiwii got this rising momentum due to lo cost-high availability hardware doubled by an enthusiastic group of people lead by Alex.
At the moment when MWC was born (early 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbaFZxh58gw&feature=plcp), the few autonomous flight platforms hardware around cost around 1000 usd. Now the gap has closed, actually you can have an autonomous flight controller with unlimited navi waypoints and scripted python actions with less than 100 usd. ( http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=go ... oductname= )

The future of multiwii consist more in relations to its members than with what it does and i think right now we need Alex active involvement. That will guarantee that Multiwii is a continuing success story and a starting point for further development.

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

dramida wrote:And one other fact:
The future of multiwii consist more in relations to its members than with what it does and i think right now we need Alex active involvement. That will guarantee that Multiwii is a continuing success story and a starting point for further development.


+1

kataventos
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by kataventos »

This dev I used (r1240) is one of the last, with the altitude coded by Mahowick, excellent coder/incredible job.

I´m working on Rushduino OSD, and in this test I made a close to ground (5m Alt Max) PH for +- 5 minutes to test behavior of MWC and to see if after the flight the ground would still be = to zero :)
This was what I experienced, pretty amazing.

(Video was removed)
Last edited by kataventos on Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

scrat
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by scrat »

vpb wrote:so all "sad" people here can't live without alt-hold :P ? and MultiWii is just that? It's improved (thanks to Mahowik) and will be improved again by someone later, there're good coders are flying multiwii out there. Alt-hold is acceptable now?

I see so many interesting features outside this topic, many nice & kind developers, please help they test & improve, instead of waiting, arguing, asking for more here.


Hi vpb: could you be so kind and share your ALT PID's please. I'm using since yesterday r1275 and I get strange resulst with ALT Hold. Thx. In r1177 it was better.

vpb
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Re: Altitude Hold improvement solution

Post by vpb »

you can try 5-6 0.20 0.30-0.50

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