Brushless direct drive GIMBAL - big revolution for a few $

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:18 am

My experiment to drive a BLC gimbal with MWii
MWii BLC

Motor 1 uses A0,A1,A2 // Roll
Motor 2 uses 9 ,10 ,11 // Nick

Use together with dev 1317 gui.

joethe3rd · Post by **joethe3rd** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:26 pm

Just found this topic, thanks for all the great info! I am going to try getting my own gimbal going soon, with the german opensource or maybe with the Alexmos hardware now that it is becoming available for purchase.

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:05 pm

Could it be possible to modify SimonK esc code to work as a BLC?

joethe3rd · Post by **joethe3rd** » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:56 pm

I was wondering about that too. There are also the ESC32 and OpenBLDC projects which are possible starting points. The OpenBLDC has not been that active in the last while, but I heard some of the developers were busy with the Quadshot and are coming back to OpenBLDC now.

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:57 pm

i guess, they using tree phase drivers so why not, more interesting would bee to have an open loop controller with 14bit magencoder on STM32 and 2.4mhz i2c.

KasparsL · Post by **KasparsL** » Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:31 pm

PatrikE wrote:Could it be possible to modify SimonK esc code to work as a BLC?

I was thinking of using some cheap Brushless ESCs - remove the controller chip and use 3 half bridge drivers left. Your idea is even better! If the outputs used to drive the motor are hardware PWM, it is duable!

skygizmo · Post by **skygizmo** » Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:03 pm

hey does anyone have list of components for the drive circuit pcb? and what size smd components?

Thanks

hexa · Post by **hexa** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:56 am

come on coderes and hardware folks. lets get the ball rolling on a english open source version circuit board

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:34 am

here you is hardware files for eagle, size wouldent be to hard to find out

http://code.google.com/p/brushless-gimb ... p&can=2&q=

hexa · Post by **hexa** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:59 am

Partlist

Exported from Gimbal Controler.sch at 07/02/2013 10:55

EAGLE Version 6.4.0 Copyright (c) 1988-2013 CadSoft

Assembly variant:

Part Value Device Package Library Sheet

C1 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C2 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C3 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C4 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C5 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C6 100µ CAP_POLD PANASONIC_D SparkFun 1
C7 100µ CAP_POLD PANASONIC_D SparkFun 1
C8 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C16 1uF CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C17 1uF CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C18 10n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C19 10n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C20 0.22uF CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C21 0.22uF CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C24 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C25 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
C29 100n CAP0805 0805 SparkFun 1
D1 ATMEGA328p-AU ATMEGA168-AU TQFP32-08 Arduino-AVR 1
D2 FT232RL FT232RL SSOP28 ftdichip 1
D3 T1 L6234 SO20POWER2 L6234 1
D4 T2 L6234 SO20POWER2 L6234 1
F1 FUSE_SMD_10MM FUSE_SMD_10MM SMD_FUSE_10MM f-lf-omniblok-s 1
H1 T67K ROT LS_T679-D2E2-1 PLCC2 led 1
H2 LG T67K GRUEN LG_T679-E1F1-1 PLCC2 led 1
JP1 M02PTH 1X02 SparkFun 1
JP2 M05PTH 1X05 SparkFun 1
JP3 M04PTH 1X04 SparkFun 1
JP4 M06SIP 1X06 SparkFun 1
JP5 M06SIP 1X06 SparkFun 1
JP6 M03PTH 1X03 SparkFun 1
JP7 M03PTH 1X03 SparkFun 1
R1 10k RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R2 10k RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R3 1k RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R4 330R RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R5 330R RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R6 1k RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
R21 10k RESISTOR0805-RES 0805 SparkFun 1
V1 DIODE-DO214AC DO214AC diode 1
V2 BAS40-04 BAS40-04 SOT23 diode 1
V3 1N4148 DIODE-MINIMELF MINIMELF diode 1
V4 1N4148 DIODE-MINIMELF MINIMELF diode 1
V5 1N4148 DIODE-MINIMELF MINIMELF diode 1
V6 1N4148 DIODE-MINIMELF MINIMELF diode 1
V7 78L05F 78L05F SOT89 linear 1
X2 USBOLD USBOLD USB-MINIB-OLD SparkFun 1
Y7 16mhz RESONATORSMD RESONATOR-SMD SparkFun 1

Download eagle pcb and choose free ware when installing, then click export part list

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:52 pm

Well I'm about to make a couple of PCB using toner transfer, a bit messy thou, planning to use teensy3 with mag encoder and then i would be able to run motors without rewinding, to achieve this it need's open loop feedback from encoder and PID pwm control, it feels like their can be some gain by having the imu mounted on the frame instead of the gimbal?

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:55 pm

The concept is to use the imu on the gimbal instead of a encoder as I understand.

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:10 pm

that's true if you going with present systems, but then it will always be one step behind, with the imu on the frame and knowing the position of the gimbal you can use high torque motors with pid

btw encoder are like 5$ and the mag 1$ or you can get free samples from Austrianmicrosystem, mail them and you get 3 for free as5048b 14bit, thats i2c witch are able to run at 2.4mhz

hexa · Post by **hexa** » Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:14 pm

Gimbal wrote:that's true if you going with present systems, but then it will always be one step behind, with the imu on the frame and knowing the position of the gimbal you can use high torque motors with pid

btw encoder are like 5$ and the mag 1$ or you can get free samples from Austrianmicrosystem, mail them and you get 3 for free as5048b 14bit, thats i2c witch are able to run at 2.4mhz

sounds good.
will need to port the code to that processor?

skygizmo · Post by **skygizmo** » Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:33 pm

Hi, succeeded in obtaining list of parts.

but have trouble finding some parts as
C12 CAP_POLPTH1 CPOL-RADIAL-100UF-25V
D1 1N4148 diode-MINIMELF MINIMELF diode
C10 0.22uF CAP0805 0805
someone who has a good place to buy? and even order numbers

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:05 am

I received a few PMs asking for parts and where does what go,
people, please install eagle program, and open the schematics,
there you can click on ''i'' icon on the left, and click on anything you like,
it will show it's name and specifications.

I took some screenshots even to show how it works.

right now I am playing with alexmos's controller from csg

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:57 am

Hi dr.Tom, nice board I'm just curious about the ticker is it 16 or 20 MHz, have had som problem running code on 328p 16 Mhz

msev · Post by **msev** » Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:52 pm

Dr.Tom so that board from cgs is directly compatible with that .hex alexmos has put on his site? Can you reverse engineer the board and draw a schematic

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:29 pm

Here's my first run of alex's board

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUn-M5rJij0

hexa · Post by **hexa** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:02 am

To run alex hex you will need his special boot loader which i think is fuse bit so wont be able to dump alex bootloader from the arv.
Alex hex is probably encrypted with inscription keys embedded in the boot-loader,

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:09 pm

could be, if he's not runing it on 20mhz
edit
guess you'r rhight about encrypting, decompiled it in avrstudio and it look's that way

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:40 am

unedited from this morning,

stock PIDs
will tune it of course
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn6YBshWX1k

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:47 am

nice commercial, no useful info thou

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:30 pm

It's not commercial because I don't sell anything, and I didn't get anything for free or on discount price.
Just put my videos online to show how can homemade gimbal (for under 250$ total) perform

no need for overpriced servo gimbals that just don't work so good...

I used 2826 and 2830 cheap rctimer motors for small gopro gimbal,
with 0.15 wire, 20 OHm to keep it cool, around 50% PWM power used @ 12V (3S LiPo)

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:49 pm

swell, just waiting for info about the crystal 16 or 20 mhz?

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:57 pm

no problem, just ask

I will try to read it if it has markings on it,
and take high-res photo and post it here in the afternoon.

msev · Post by **msev** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 4:42 pm

dr.tom wrote:unedited from this morning,

stock PIDs
will tune it of course
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn6YBshWX1k

Doctor what a nice new examination apparatus you have here hehe

...That nurse of yours looked like she saw an alien.

If I ever feel sick while I'm in Croatia (you are from Zagreb right?), I'll visit you, surely I'll be soon better with a dose of quad copters

Some laughs, just kiddin'

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:04 pm

2 msev: who knows... maybe I can find some use of this stabilisation in surgery

Gimbal wrote:swell, just waiting for info about the crystal 16 or 20 mhz?

don't laugh if I took a pic of a wrong component on the board,
I believe this is it.

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:21 am

thnx drtom, pic don't say mutch can you see if it say's 16 or 20 on it

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:05 am

It only has ''Ad. '' on it
I was expecting something like this, my mwii and promini boards have osc. more similat to that.

jy0933 · Post by **jy0933** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:47 am

seems the firmware is updating at 8khz .... annoying whining

but the performance is really impressive

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:09 am

whining can be heard at <1m in quiet room only, GoPro is 100x closer than that

1cm.

but during gimbal operating, the propellers are creating much more noise, so it isn't really a problem,
pilot can't hear it,

msev · Post by **msev** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:32 am

Yeah but considering how little it cost in actual manufacturing costs to build such a board, the price is a bit on the high side...

Are there any new improvements in that german opensource gimbal?

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:55 pm

well if price are an isue, check out this one ;-)

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1793759

bob4432 · Post by **bob4432** » Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:33 am

here is a complete open source unit - http://j.mp/XQOEf4 - eagle files - everything - http://j.mp/Yp191m

anybody compare it to the alexmos setup?

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:25 am

Discussed in this thread earlier and called the "german"

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:12 pm

insane brushless gimbal test done by a friend of mine.

DJI zenmuse, you can pack your bags and go home

from 0:50

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... CngdQJFrsU

Jonit · Post by **Jonit** » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:24 pm

man, that's unreal!! and also crazy flying skills! ... do you know which motors he is using for the gimbal?

NikTheGreek · Post by **NikTheGreek** » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:19 pm

Question...may be foolish. :oops:

Why no one does not use stepper motors?

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:28 am

Price,Weight????
Many people have a pile of BLC motors laying around.
Not the same with steppers for me anyway!

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:00 am

I just downloaded the lates code from that German guy and I'm having trouble compiling the code.
Can anyone tell me if I'm doing this right
First I downloaded the lates code file
Then extract it to arduino/libraries
Then open arduino/examples select the file
Then compile.
"Error compiling"

Is there anything I need to do different?
Any help would be great thanks

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:41 pm

my latest video 8-)

this brushless thing really works great

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQB33amS ... =1&index=1

EOSBandi · Post by **EOSBandi** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:00 am

I still see some horizon issues

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:56 am

2EosBandi: jest, tuning is needed, just like in everything else on our models

1080p available

speed up version,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCglXcCtqXg&hd=1

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Sun Apr 14, 2013 11:03 am

normal speed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atNp64r6QR4&hd=1

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Mon Apr 15, 2013 10:21 am

WIND test

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB_yimnSae0

Church

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTZ32_a-8Rg

dr.tom · Post by **dr.tom** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:18 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gr9Nrw2TFXQ&hd=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJwZZbjZSeQ&hd=1

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 7:31 am

Really like drTom's Sunday morning bulletin :ugeek:

PatrikE · Post by **PatrikE** » Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:00 pm

Hi drTom.

What firmware do you use?

Just got my BLC card on the mail preloaded with the code from http://brushlessgimbal.de/

Patrik

Gimbal · Post by **Gimbal** » Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:35 pm

I'm darn sure he's using Alexmos and it using it's owne bootloader, so unless you fix the bootloader you're stuck with the kraut code, which are not bad.
I'v got both but still waiting for the Camgimbal :mrgreen:

, will post som sort of review later....