Nanocopter Frames

Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:24 am

Since a while I have a Blade Nano QX which makes a lot of fun in the house if you are not able to fly outside. This inspired me to a small project and I started to develop few durable Nanocopter frames. Beside of FC’s from industrial multicopters like the Nano QX, Ladybird and many others I found a very nice FC’s at Hobby King “Micro MWC” and “Mini MWC”. Both FC’s already contain a Spektrum compliant DSM2 receiver and the Micro version has already 4 brushed ESC’s. Also search for "CARTE CONTROLEUR / RX DSM2 POUR MICRO QUADCOPTERE CORELESS" where you will find another interesting FC. This FC's are ideal for the Nanocopter project. A very good selection of motors can be found at Micro Motor Warehouse. Actually I have designed 3 different Nano Frames (Quad, Hexa, Okto). The frames will be made from 2mm carbon. The motor mounts will be 3D printed and are available for tree different motor sizes (6, 7 and 8.5mm). Please see pictures in the flowing post for getting an idea. Parts for the 0 series of the Quadcopter and the different motor mounts are already in production and should arrive next days for an initial fitting tests. If there will be some interest in the community I would do a larger series after some initial test. Please let me know what you think about this and if there is interest. My actual estimate for a quad frame would about 25-30€. For the Hexa and the Octo it will be more. Final prices will also depend on the number of units for the series. There is also a similar project in the RC Groups forum if you search for “Vulkanette” you will find it. This Project also gave me some inspiration.
Last edited by mj666 on Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:29 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:09 am

Here are some Pictures.

The diagonal motor center measure is:

NanoQuad 110mm
NanoHexa 120mm
NanoOcto 156mm

The base diameter of the motor mounts is 11mm

I also did a design with 10mm motor mounts (NanoQuadSlim) and I will check if this is the one I will use for the final series.
Attachments
NanoOcto.jpg
Octocopter
NanoHexa.jpg
Hexacopter
NanoQuad.jpg
Quadcopter
NanoQuadSlim.jpg
Quadcopter Slim Version (Motormunt base is 10 intead of 11mm)
MotorMount_8.5mm.jpg
Motor Mount for 8,5mm Motor (Basediameter 11mm)
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:20 am

First samples for the motor mounts are arrived. Some shape optimization is required for the series. Specially in the area of the clips. I’m still waiting for the frame samples and the motors in the different sizes to make the fitting test.
Attachments
MotorMount2.jpg
MotorMount1.jpg
MotorMount.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Apr 05, 2014 11:43 am

Here we go. Sample frames also arrived. The fit of the motor mount is quite good. Only the design of the clips for fixing the mounts in the frame need to be reviewed. In the worst case a drop of clue will help (the clue need to work for Nylon). Now only the motors for the fitting tests are missing. Then I will make final updates and be ready for a small series. Let me know if there is some interest so I can make some more.

Please PM me for prices if you are interested. Question is also if you are interested to get a spare motor mount in the kit and which size for the motor mount (6, 7, 8.5mm) and what kind of copter (Quad, Hexa, Octo). I’m planning to order my first production batch by end of next week. This will contain likely a few frames of each shape mainly quad’s and 7 and 8.5mm motor mounts. The slim version most likly wont make it. The weigth of the Quadframe is about 8g and 10g including the motor mounts.

BTW: Prices are a bit cheaper than initialy expected.
Attachments
NanoQuad.jpg
Frame2.jpg
Frame1.jpg
Frame.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby o_lampe » Mon Apr 07, 2014 3:10 pm

I'm flying the HK pocket quad. I don't see how their design could be improved because the FCs PCB also has arms for the motormounts.
Building a Nano Hex- or Octo-copter would be interesting, but lacks of Controllers with more than 4 brushed ESCs onboard.
If I would be you, I'd start with the design of a Hex/Octo-PCB with integrated arms and ESCs.
Anything else just means additional weight.

Just my two Cent
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue Apr 08, 2014 7:29 am

I ordered some new samples for the motor mounts with a revised design. With the new design the clips are much stronger and and the motor need to be finally pushed in after attaching the mounts to the frame. The will also look the clips in place and will not allow them to snap of the frame anymore.

@o_lampe
The goal for this design is mainly durability. You see many people breaking the arms of the HK Pocket Quad. In this case you need a whole new copter. The design I’m looking for is nearly undestroyable. Brushed ESC's are quite simple only 2 resistors and a FET are required. MultiWii and Basflight will already support the output for brushed ESC’s. An very small extension board would do the job. This is may be another project to support Hexa- and Octocopters. For the Octo my plan for now is to fly this in a Quad configuration with two motors in parallel. This should work without problems with a brushed ESC if the current for 2 motors is available. For sure also a FC with 8 brushed ESC’s natively would be nice.
Attachments
MotorMount3.jpg
Revised design
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:11 pm

Back from vacation and tested the new motor mount samples. Now I’m very satisfied with the fit and the design of the clips to fix them in the frame. Also my first motors are arrived and they fit also very well. Please see attached pictures for the 8.5mm mount. Now I adjusted the design again to have enough room for the battery below the frame and using the motor mounts also as landing gear (design also in the attached pictures). I finally orderd a first small batch of frames (all types), 7 and 8.5mm Motor mounts. Unfortunately I’m still waiting for my Micro MWC FC’s from HK (it is a month from the order now).
Attachments
MotorMount_8.5mm New.jpg
MotorMount_3.jpg
MotorMount_2.jpg
MotorMount_1.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue May 06, 2014 8:06 am

The project is progressing. Working on two Quads with CL-0720-12-P and CL-0820-15 coreless motors for now. Still waiting for some plugs to proceed. Will also upgrade the FET's of the Micro WMC to 6A types before mounting the plugs just in case. The final weight will be around 50g including battery.
Attachments
NanoQuad3.jpg
NanoQuad2.jpg
NanoQuad1.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue May 13, 2014 7:20 am

The first NanoQuad with 7mm motors is now flying. With the 750mAh battery the flight time is about 9-10min indoor and the actual takeoff weight is 48g. I will also try Ladybird propellers the next days since they will have 10mm more diameter and I expect a bit more power from them. It would also be possible to fly with an smaller battery and the first batch of frames will also get some additional weight savings. I may also do a video outdoor next days if someone can take the camera. For the NanoQuad with 8.5mm motor version I still wait for the crimp tool to assemble the plugs to the motors.
Attachments
NanoQuad6.jpg
NanoQuad5.jpg
NanoQuad4.jpg
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Nanocopter Frames

Postby OrbitCowboy » Thu May 15, 2014 7:32 pm

I'm reading your build/design thread with interest. Best of success with this and please keep going!
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun May 18, 2014 9:35 pm

Last days I did quite some test flights. I tried some larger propellers (65mm) without better results. The power was quite similar like the Hubsan propellers but motors get really hot. I also tried a 400 mAh battery and with this it was working quit well. The reduced weight make the quad climbs and accelerates much better. The flight time outdoor is about 5-6 min. My Blade Nano QX with the CL-0615-14 tuning motors is still faster. I also could test the durability which was one of the design goals. The frame already resisted a few crashes without any damage. My PID's also still need to be tuned. Now I’m looking for some more tests with the 8.5mm motors, the weight reduce frames and may be the larger propellers again. Still need to find someone to take a video. In general the project is progressing quite well.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Thu May 29, 2014 12:45 pm

Finished my CL-0820-15 motor build during the last days. This is flying realy well with the 750 mAh battery (52g) and also with a 5 g heavier 950 mAh one. Acceleration and climb rate is really good. I’m still using the more heavier frame since my weight optimized frames are no yet arrived. The battery is mounted with 3M dual look clips. The HK Micro MWC I upgraded with 6A rated FET's (may be not needed but more easy if done before the connector sockets are mounted). The crimp tool PA-09 works quite well to mount the plugs to the motors and has an affordable price (the connectors are really tiny).

The CL-0720-12-P motor build is flying also very well with lighter batteries (260-300mAh). With the larger batteries its missing a bit of punch but is fine for normal flying.

Interestingly the receiver output was much different for the two HK Micro MWC boards. I need to build different configurations for both Quads. The MIDRC value is 1470 and 1530 also the endpoints of the transmitter output (1050-1850, 1100-1925) are very different. I’m using the same model in the transmitter. I have a third board and the output is different again.

Unfortunately it's raining today and not good weather for flying (Quad flipped himself during flying in light rain, as expected no damage, but still not a good idea to fly).
Attachments
accu1.jpg
accu2.jpg
NanoQuad8.jpg
NanoQuad7.jpg
NanoQuadL.jpg
Weight Optimized Frames Design
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 7:54 am

Today I finaly post two videos. This is the 0820-15 Motor build with Micro WMC, Hubsan Propellers and the 750mAh battery (Pictures in the previous post). As you can see its flying very well and is very robust against crashing. Now I fly with WK Ladybird propellers. Performance is similar but visibility is much better (orange color).

http://youtu.be/n3CnaRyho4E
http://youtu.be/6MJAvkHMXXc
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby A1axx » Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:04 pm

Hi,

I have pm'd you for a price on a frame and plugs. But it is staying in the outbox!
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Jun 21, 2014 7:46 am

@A1axx you have a PM with prices and some useful hints.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Jun 28, 2014 9:20 pm

The new NanoQuad Frames are arrived. Here is also a picture of the new build. Hexa and Octo frames will follow. Also need to wait for some new FC's and motors to arrive.
Attachments
Frames.jpg
NanoQuadNew.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby LTMNO » Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:55 pm

Great project!
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Thu Jul 10, 2014 10:53 pm

Hexa- and Octocopter frames are arrived and the project makes some progress again. Here are the different weights of the new frames.
Code: Select all
   Frame only   Frame with motor mounts
Quad   4g      6g
Hexa   6g      10g
Octo   12g      16g

My copter fleet is continuously growing. Actually I have the folloing Quadcopters flying:

Quadcopter. Micro MWC, CL-0720-12 motors
2 x Quadcopter. Micro MWC, CL-0820-15 motors

Actually I’m planning to finish the following configurations:

Quadcopter. Micro MWC, CL-0820-17 motors
Hexacopter, AfroMini32, Deltang Rx31 receiver, CL-0820-15 motors, 2x 4 cannel brushed motor controllers (Pial.net)
Octocopter, AfroMini32, Deltang Rx31 receiver, CL-0820-15 motors, 2x 4 cannel brushed motor controllers (Pial.net)
Octocopter (QuadX configuration, 4x2 motors in parallel), Micro MWC, CL-0820-15 motors

All quads should be powered by a 750mAh or 950mAH battery. Below you can see some new pictures.
Attachments
HexaFrame.jpg
OctoFrame.jpg
Electronics1.jpg
Electronics2.jpg
HexaCopter.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:36 pm

The Nano Hexacopter had successful maiden flight today. Building the brushed motor controllers was challenging and tock me a few hours. Next time I may go for the ready build version from pial.net. I lost a few resistors fortunately a could get some replacements from my collection of old electronic components. Everything else was strait forward. Configured Baseflight and it’s flying with more or less default settings. Here are the only changes I did:

Code: Select all
mixer HEX6X
feature PPM
feature FAILSAFE
map TAER1234
set motor_pwm_rate = 32000

and configuring the AUX channels. I may still need to change the “minthrottle” value. I’m not used that motors are spinning if the copter gets armed.

I was only flying in the garden yet and need to see how it goes when I have more space and can go faster. A single brushed flight controller for a Hex and Octocopter with integrated receiver would be really nice and would avoid using so many components. Below you find a few new pictures.
Attachments
BrushedESC.jpg
NanoHexa1.jpg
NanoHexa2.jpg
NanoHexa3.jpg
NanoHexa4.jpg
NanoOcto1.jpg
NanoOcto2.jpg
Last edited by mj666 on Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:03 am

I have flown the NanoHexa for quite a while. It is actually flying realy well and has good power. Here are the settings I actually used in the CLI:

Code: Select all
aux 0 32
aux 1 2
aux 2 4
aux 3 256
mixer HEX6X
feature PPM
feature FAILSAFE
feature -VBAT
map TAER1234
set minthrottle = 1000
set maxthrottle = 2000
set failsafe_throttle = 1350
set motor_pwm_rate = 32000
save


The yaw speed could be a bit higher and I still experimenting on this (rc rates, yaw P value, etc.).

The NanoOcto is also nearly ready and I hope I get it finished quite soon. I only missing the connection of the power distribution and connecting motor 7 and 8 output to the brushed controllers. Need to get some thin wire (enamelled copper wire) first and a real steady hand :) . Still waiting for some more Micro MWC (to build the NanoOcto (QuadX configuration) and the speeder quad with the CL-0820-17 motors. It looks to be the package is lost. Waiting already 7+ weeks and there is no change in tracking information since more than a month. In the meantime I have also a lot of fun with the 2 NanoQuads.

Here is some important information for others which plan to build something similar. If you are flashing or configuring Baseflight at your FC using brushed ESC’s and have a default configuration please be sure you motors are disconnected. This is one reason why I have plugs for all my motors beside you can more easy replace motors without soldering. After initialization with default parameters Baseflight will send output signals for brushless ESC’s and this will cause all the brushed motors to run at relative high speed already. If only USB is connected the current of 500mA from USB will not be enough to start the motors but the USB port will switch of for a while since the motors will draw much more current. If you are unlucky it may damage your USB port. After setting the “motor_pwm_rate” for brushed motors (>500Hz) and reboot you will be fine. You also can flash with the Chrome Baseflight APP this can be configured to keep the configuration and motors will not spin up as long the FC was properly programmed before. Anyhow if major configuration options change in the Baseflight firmware between versions it may reinitialize the configuration and you also will end up in a default configuration. So better always be save and disconnect motors during upgrading or programming.

One other option would be to connect the FC via a shotky diode. This will allow you to power the controller via USB only to program it as long there is no battery connected. I personally always avoid to connect USB and a battery at the same time to be save. 5V from USB and 4,2V or less from battery may not give a good combination and it looks to be there is a direct connection between the two power supply's?

Here are some new pictures:
Attachments
NanoOcto3.jpg
NanoOcto4.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Aug 17, 2014 1:50 pm

Back from vacation finally all my ordered Micro WMC's are arrived. I should have enough of them for a while. As always I change the FET’s to 6A versions before using them. Since I’m doing this, I only had one dead FET when the motor itself had an internal short. I have finished the Octocopter in Quad configuration. Please see the pictures below for the “NanoOctoQuad”. I also finished the Nanoquad with the CL-0820-17 motors. No new pictures for this one since its equal to my other NanaoQuad's except the different motors. As you may see I’m using the 2mm JST plugs now and have modified the sockets (removed to back wall with a diamont nail file of 3 sockets) to fit into the micro WMC. This will allow to keep the prefitted plugs for the CL-0810-17 Motors. For the Octocopter I crimped always two motors in parallel to one plug. The distance and diameter of the holes in the PCB exactly fit. Both Nanocopters had there maiden flight today. The Quad is really going like a bullet.
Attachments
NanoOctoQuad1.jpg
NanoOctoQuad2.jpg
NanoOctoQuad3.jpg
Last edited by mj666 on Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:56 pm

Today i made an video of the Nano Octocopter from previous post.

Nano Octocopter (QuadX configuration, 4x2 motors in parallel), Micro MWC (6A FET's), MultiWii 2.3, CL-0820-15 motors, 950mAh Turnigy nano-tech battery

http://youtu.be/UaK8Hk_aCuQ

It was quite windy day (see also the wind cone in the video). Enjoy the video.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby ArrogantDuck » Tue Aug 26, 2014 12:22 pm

Nice little craft!

If it could do fpv/a mobius, I think I may have to get one.

This could be a bit safer over a crowd...

Nice.

You should advertise/start a thread at rcgroups in the multirotor forum. You may, though, get a lot more orders than you want.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby e_lm_70 » Tue Aug 26, 2014 1:59 pm

Very nice.

Did I see right, that you handle the octa .. like a normal X copter, with 2 motor in parallel over the same control signal ?
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue Aug 26, 2014 8:32 pm

@ArogantDuck

Not sure if it can carry a Mobius Cam (38g) which is about half the weight of the whole Nanocopter (86g). The Mobius Cam can be stripped then it’s may be much more lite or a stripped KeyCam #16 can be used. It definitely need to be placed somewhere away from the Propellers since they are very narrow. I spread some links to this tread in RCGroups already.

@e_lm_70

Yes each brushed ESC (upgraded with a 6A FET) is driving two motors in parallel. If you look to some of my previous posts in this tread you can see also a Hexacopter and a real Octocopter build. The Octocopter is still not finished yet.

Here are the different weights of the Nanocopters with battery:

NanoHexa 74g
NanoOcto (quadx config) 86g
NonoOcto 92g
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby ArrogantDuck » Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:40 pm

Haha,
So cool that it is almost lighter than a mobius.

Cool. Still worthy of a get just to play with it... I'm thinking...
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:32 pm

@ArogantDuck

For FPV I'm using a Venom (folding Quad) from Ramsey Innovations.

If you are interested in an kit (frame and motor mounts) please drop me an PM and I can send you details.
Last edited by mj666 on Mon Sep 15, 2014 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Thu Aug 28, 2014 12:00 am

Looks to be I can reduce the production cost of the motor mounts if they will be printed in groups as a block. Since my first batch is nearly used I’m preparing for a new one. If everything is going well as planed, there will be 49 motor mounts in a block and they can be separated with a sharp knife. Also I will do some minor improvement in the design (a more tide motor fit, stronger clips) for this batch.

Over the last months I did really a lot of flying with the multiple NanoQuads. Sometimes daily 10-20 flights (before and after work). This was a couple of hundred flights and also quite some crashing. I only broke 2 frames and about 10 motor mounts during this time. This means the design is really very robust which was one of the goals. Most motor mounts broke with the first frames. They were really stiff. The newer design is having some kind of a spring functions and so the motor mount also resist much harder crashes. The usual failure was broken clips. In many cases I was still flying with them for a while before I changed them since they are still holding properly in the frame. I changed them when a motor breaks and I need to do repairs anyhow. I have about 15 failed motors during this time. Some of them I really lost in crashes but most are weared out and reached the end of their live. In this case always the brushes are failing. One motor had an internal short and this killed the FET of the FC. Even the 6A type will not be able to resist this. Since I fly with Ladybird propellers I will be sure to open them up at the top and move them down at the axis a much as possible. They will give enough play during flight but this will save the motor during a crash since the axis cannot break the bottom of the motor or the brushes. Below you can see the new design for the motor mounts. For now I will only do new 8.5mm motor mounts since I still have quite some 7mm left.
Attachments
MotorMounts_7x7.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Wed Sep 17, 2014 6:34 am

The new motor mounts are arrived. Frame kits and spare motor mounts are getting cheaper now. Also some more frames are on there way.
Attachments
MotorMount_7x7a.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:50 pm

Here are some tips and tricks for everyone who is using my frames.

- If you are using motors with prefitted plugs you need to put the cable already into position before mounting the motor mount into the frame. The motor need to be mounted finally only after the motor mount is completely fitted into the frame. This will lock the clips in the frame.
- The motor mounts need some support to slide into the final position. Help the clips to go into the frame since the surface is a bit raw from 3D printing and the frame could have some sharp edges (if you don’t remove them). If you only force them from the top you risk to break them.
- First generation motor mounts need a layer of Tesafilm at the motor to have a tide fit. Last kits with 8.5mm motor mounts I send out already contain second generation motor mounts.
- For my NanoQuads I’m using a combination of the 3M dual look clips and Velcro tape to fix the battery. For the NanoHexa and NanoOcto I’m only using the 3M dual look clips.
- To mount the FC (Micro MWC) I’m using small (5x5mm, 2mm thick) double sided foam pads. They came in a larger sheet about 20x20 pieces. For the NanoQuad I use two layers to get space for the Velcro tape under the FC. Using 2 pads at the front corners and 3 pads near the plugs. I may do some picture next time I build a new one. Here are the links of similar products:
http://www.amazon.de/HEYDA-Klebepads-we ... pads+5x5mm
http://www.amazon.com/Bostik-Blu-Tack-A ... +foam+pads

Everything else should be straight forward.

Update: Here are now some pictures regarding the usage of the foam pads:
Attachments
PadsA.jpg
PadsB.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:57 pm

Here is now finally also a video of the Nano Hexacopter. I cut a few flight videos together.

Nano Hexacopter, AfroMini32, Deltang Rx31 receiver, CL-0820-15 motors, 2x 4 cannel brushed motor controllers (Pial.net), 950mAh Turnigy nano-tech battery

http://youtu.be/vqk6tMqQTYc
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:45 pm

Here is a picture how 3 of the 4 JST PH 2.0 2-Pin sockets need to be modified to fit the Micro MWC FC.
Attachments
JST PH.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Superfubario » Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:52 am

Nice frames. Love the Octo. Thanks for answering my PM. Ill be getting back to you soon.

I been wanting to try out one of the Micro MWC for a project and this this would be a great one. I love the way you did the motors in pairs. Would you be able to expand more on how you upgraded the Fets on it (name/type of Fet used)? I would like to do mine as well. I have the soldiering skills just need to know what to order :P

Im undecided on motor. I have easy access to 7mm as I have a few nano qx and a hobby shop at the end of my block. 8.5 i would have to order all 8 online....decisions.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:35 am

I'm using an hot air soldering station for upgrading the FET's. In the following thread you can find valuable information regarding the Micro MWC. The first post also contains links to choices for stronger FET'S and an video from Benedikt how to replace them.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1993117

I'm personaly using IRLML6244 (20V, 6,3A) FET's from Reichelt Elektronik in Germany. I also was using successfully TSM3404 (30V, 5,8A) FET's from eBay.

Please be aware nQX motors are 6mm only. I only have a few prototype of this size in different stages an never ordered a bigger amount. Till now also nobody is asking for them. The avalble number of 7mm motor mounts is actually also a bit limited but i still have some for a few more Nanocopters. The 8.5 mm mounts are te most commonly used ones. Most of my motors i have ordered from Micro Motor Warehouse (Benedikt).
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:55 am

For the Octocopter with the Micro MWC i have some strange effect. You need to let the motors running slowly on ground for a few seconds before you give a full push and start flying. Otherwise the MWC will shut motors of and disarm. This will not happen again during flight even if pushed very hardly. Actually I'm using the Benedikt sketch. I have not seen this with the original firmware before but i may was always more careful at the beginning with the new build. If you know this, there is no problem as you can see in the video. This Octocopter is able to fly much faster as in the video, but i wanted to be sure the camera could follow.

I may try some of the other firmware options in the near future.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Superfubario » Fri Oct 31, 2014 12:04 pm

Thank you for the info. I decided on the 8.5 motor anyway as I sourced some from banggood for a decent price. Thanks for the heads up on the flight controller as well.

Just have to wait for my pay to come in then I be grabbing up a nano octo. Can't wait!!
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sun Nov 02, 2014 6:36 pm

Today i had most of my Nanocopers on the flying field. I took the chance and made a picture of the active fleet. More than half of them are based on the frames describe here in this thread. The NanoQuads have different motors CL-0820-15, CL-0820-17 and Banggood 8.5mm motors.
Attachments
My Fleet.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Plüschi » Thu Nov 06, 2014 7:35 pm

Hi,

I have the code to run a hexa with 8khz hardware pwm on the micro-mwc 328, but i have no hexa hardware. The idea how-to-do is inspired by "offbyone" on rcgroups.

I do run the timer0 at 8khz instead of 1khz, and use timer0 for pin6 and 5 hardware pwm output. Since timer0 is also used for micros() function i had to patch the wiring.c file in "arduino-1.0.5\hardware\arduino\cores\arduino".

Bonus point is the PPM input resolution goes from 4us to 1us :)

Note output.cpp is missing the hexa mixer (too lazy to fix), and changes are fore 328 / 8khz pwm only. Files attached.
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six-8khzpwm.zip
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Thu Nov 06, 2014 8:12 pm

I have most of the required hardware available to build such Hexacopter. Building the two missing brushed ESC's freely wired is kind of challenging and will not give a nice build. I have used all the Pial controllers I actually had and don't want to start disassemble my NanoOcto build I'm working on. At the beginning I had something similar with the Micro MWC in mind but since I also was working with STM32 based FC's I selected the AfroMini32 for my NanoHexa and NanoOcto builds. The separate ESC's are not optimal but for now the only way to go.

I could order a few more Pial controllers (if I do, I will only go for assembled versions :D ) and give a try but shipping will really take ages from US to Germany and is half the price of a controller. My dream is still an all in one FC integrating 8 brushed ESC's and the RX.

AlienQuads is also working on a brushed Hexacopter FC based on the ATMeag32u4:

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=3635&start=20#p57727
http://vimeo.com/109747710
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:54 am

I have finished the real NanoOctocopter today. Soldering the wires for motor 7 and 8 was a real challenge. Used a drop of hot glue to protect the soldering joints there. I have burned/killed one AfroMini32 in this process ;). Below I have some pictures. Have also done the maiden flight today now some additional tuning will start. I'm actually using the latest Baseflight firmware with the following setting.

Code: Select all
aux 0 32
aux 1 2
aux 2 4
aux 3 256
mixer OCTOFLATX
feature PPM
feature FAILSAFE
feature -VBAT
map TAER1234
set minthrottle = 1000
set maxthrottle = 2000
set failsafe_throttle = 1350
set motor_pwm_rate = 32000
set rc_rate = 100
set rc_expo = 0
set yaw_rate = 90
set p_yaw = 60
save


The motor test in the GUI is quite helpful to check if all motors are properly connected. Please be sure disconnect the motors during flashing and configuring the FC. I already posted details before in this thread why this should be done. I still don't use the shotky diode since I will loose 0.2-0.3V witch may cost you some safety during low battery.

Edit: I just taped the RX on top of the AfroMini32 to remove some reception disturbances when the battery is going lower. Picture added.
Attachments
NanoOcto8.jpg
NanoOctoHexa.jpg
NanoOcto5.jpg
NanoOcto6.jpg
NanoOcto7.jpg
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Superfubario » Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:20 pm

Very cool. What are you flight times with the octo on them 950 batteries your using. I have a 850 3 cell I no longer have use for and was going to part them out to 3 1 cells for my octo.

Still waiting on my motors.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:38 pm

I stop flying after 6min. Have a timer set in the TX. This will leave me with 4.65-4.7V left in the battery.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Tue Nov 18, 2014 9:04 pm

Between a lot of rain I find some time to make a flying video of the Nano Octocopter build. I have used a stationary Mobius Cam.

http://youtu.be/Ifs9kz5AJ9k
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Superfubario » Sat Nov 29, 2014 6:24 pm

Got mine together but going down hill with the MWC. Was just flipping at first and when I powered up throttle the LEDs would go dim and the quad would go full throttle on its own and brown out. Tried a capacitor like mentioned on RCgroups but now clockwise motors wont spin at all. REmoved cap and tested motors on other channels motors are good but when pluged back into clockwise channel still no go. Tried changing one of the fets (I upgraded to the 5amp ones recommended) still nothing. Might have fried my board :(.

Frame is nice though..just hobby king board giving me headache.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Nov 29, 2014 6:59 pm

Ma be you should go for an AlienWii. They are available from Micro Motor Warehouse in the US and my not have a long shipping time. Be aware you also need an Spektrum compatible satellite receiver.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby Superfubario » Sat Nov 29, 2014 7:53 pm

got the motor thing sorted out...all motors fire up properly now (was loose solder joint). Still flipping once i try to fly though. Still investigating.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Sat Nov 29, 2014 11:20 pm

What sketch are you using? Do you have changed any settings? Do you have calibrated the ACC? You activated any additional flight mode like HORIZON or ANGLE? Do all motors spin freely? If you blow over the propellers they all need to start spinning easily. Hold the Octo in your hand and give full throttle for 30s-1min (does the capacitor help to avoid a dropout?). Otherwise put is on a table an let it start spinning quite slowly for 20-40s and then hold it and give full throttle (if it works). Check all motors after this if you find one which is getting hot. If you have a bad motor you can find it likely at the side where it is trying to flip to. I know this kind of behavior shortly before an motor fails but your motors should be new. Hope this help.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Fri Dec 05, 2014 12:09 am

Just learned the Deltang Rx31 in serial mode will work like any Spektrum satellite receiver and you can avoid double conversion to PPM and back. Please see also here:

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=5177&start=100#p59496
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Fri Dec 12, 2014 7:12 pm

There is really something new coming from outer space for our brushed Hexa and Octocopters. Please stay tuned. :o :D

http://alienwii.com/

Several ARM STM32 versions of the AlienWii that support up to 8 motors out of the box are also currently being prototyped at Area5749. Pictures will appear here once I take them.
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Re: Nanocopter Frames

Postby mj666 » Wed Dec 31, 2014 6:55 pm

Here are some news again. Last days I finished an new NanoHexa and an new NanoOctocopter build with an new AlienWii prototype FC. Here you can find some more details:
http://alienwii.com/alienwii-brushed-stm32-octo-fc/
I was working with Alienquads over the last 2 months and this is the actual result. The controller can run with 32bit Cleanflight or Baseflight firmware. Even if the standard Naze32 firmware is running without problems for best results an slightly updated firmware version should be used to support all feature of the controller. Cleanflight has the required updates already implemented as a separate target (ALIENWIIF1) since a few days. We are planning some more improvements here. Please stay tuned.
Attachments
AlienWii32_Hexa.jpg
AlienWii32_Octo.jpg
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